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Joint | May 6, 2013 | Chamber | Gamefish Hearing

Full MP3 Audio File

Ladies and gentlemen, I want to thank everybody for being here today. Just to give you an idea of how things are going to work today, I was waiting for Representative Tom Murry to get here, I do not see him yet, but he was going to go through the bill in its entirety to give you a summary of everything that is inside the bill. Once we do that we will start with four speakers. Our first four speakers will have up to 10 minutes to speak. We have two in opposition of the bill, two in favor of the bill and all four of those gentlemen are sitting over here. After that, if you’ll listen for your name to be read you will have up to two minutes to speak after that and to address the members of the General Assembly that are here and also to address the public. Everyone will be speaking from the front here. We would like to do our best to have everything accomplished by four o’clock today. With your patience I believe we can do that. Just a couple of House rules that you need to know. One, I know there’s a lot of passion behind this issue whether it be from the commercial side or from the sportsman’s side. We’re all aware of the emails and we’re all aware this has been an ongoing issue for many years. I would ask that everyone that addresses the group today be polite and respectful and listen. If at any time the debate gets out of control or if people are being disrespectful we will close the debate and we will be done for today. With that said, I would like to ask our first speaker to come forward. When you reach the podium, if you would, identify yourself. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you Representative Bell and members of the General Assembly and the public. My name is Jerry Schill of Perfection, North Carolina. It’s a crossroads near Cove City in Craven County. I’ll give you a little background so you may understand my strong opposition to this bill, particularly the game fish status part of it. Although I represented North Carolina’s commercial fishing industry for 18 years from 1987 until ’05, I currently have no economic interest in fishing either commercially or recreationally. I have never held a commercial fishing license, have never sold a fish and I do not fish for recreation. I have a son-in-law that owns Etheridge Fishing Supply in Wanchese, North Carolina and his customers are primarily commercial fishermen. I currently work, well, employee is a better word for Mackilwean Turf Company in Craven County but next week will begin a ministry as program director for the STAFF House Maternity Home in New Bern. In a voluntary role I was a founding member of the Craven-Pamlico Christian Coalition in 1994 and currently serve as its chairman. Since I’m not involved personally in either recreational or commercial fishing, why am I here to talk about game fish? First, to provide a little bit of historical background to you regarding fisheries management in general and the game-fish issue specifically. More importantly because I’m a seafood consumer. Allow me to begin with a parable. Some young men who have a very physical farm job were on their way to work one day from New Bern to Goldsboro. Their gray-haired supervisor was listening to their conversations about certain lifestyle choices and he began to minister to them about responsibility, being married as opposed to shacking up. One of them asked, “How long have you been married?” The supervisor said, “Almost 45 years.” “Wow,” the workers said, “How can you do that?” The supervisor told the crew that he wanted to buy a milk cow about a year ago but the idea was quickly vetoed by his wife. Being quick on his feet the man remembered that an Amish man had told him to consider a milk goat rather than a milk cow, “They’re easier to take care of, they’re cheaper and the milk is better for you.” So he tried that approach with his wife. That didn’t work either. He ended up with a male neutered beagle, “And that my brothers his how you stay married for 45 years.” It’s called compromise. And we certainly know the meaning of that word in fisheries management. I served as a fisheries regulator as a member of the South Atlantic Fishery Management Council for two three-year terms, appointed from 1989 to ’92, then reappointed from ’92 to ’95. I was appointed by the US Secretary of Commerce upon nomination of Governor Jim Martin. I know what it’s like to participate in contentious debate on fish issues and have done my share in this building. Especially in the ‘90s on the discussions on the Fisheries Reform Act which was signed by Governor Jim Hunt in 1997 using a pen that I still have. It was not one of my happiest days as there were some commercial fishermen who wondered what side I was on when we made some hard-fought compromises.

…to keep the peace. Prior to that debate, however, there were a couple of notable battles here in the general assembly. The first began with a press conference in the legislative building by former Representative Billy Richardson. Members of the Coastal Conservation Association walk in with him. He introduced a bill that would have allowed for a non-binding ballot referendum on a net ban. The bill died in the rules committee but I mention it to you so you understand why there is some earned paranoia by commercial fishermen. In other words, there’s been talk of a net ban in this general assembly prompted by the CCA. Even a few years earlier, 1988, I received the newspaper article from Florida written by a sportswriter with the headline “Good News, Redfish is Now Game Fish.” Along with this comment by the sportswriter, “Yes friends, let’s continue to make commercial fisherman the endangered species and you can bet your last dollar that no one will rally around to save that species.” Game fish in Florida was supported by the Florida Conservation Association and fully supported a net ban a few years later. Point being, paranoia is justified. Back to North Carolina in the 90s, Senator Marc Basnight introduced a bill that would have banned menhaden fishing off the beaches in Dare County. When trying to reason with Senator Basnight, then Senate Pro Tem, he told me he would introduce the bill he would push it and he would pass it and pass it did, easily, in the senate in the house committees. However it was defeated on the house floor with the coalition of house republicans then in the minority in the black caucus. It’s important to note that this bill was not introduced for any biological concern but only because certain well-heeled residents of Dare County didn’t like the looks of menhaden boats fishing off the beach and the concern about a possible fish bill on the beach. The Fisheries Reform Act was passed with the support of recreational, commercial and environmental interests. From our perspective, the positives outweighed the negatives with a primary plus being the forum for fisheries discussions could be at newly revised Marine Fisheries Commission. It seemed to us that making our argument before a board of less than a dozen with interest and knowledge of coastal issues would be superior than coming to Raleigh and bog down the system here. I would like to address the issue of financial support for commercial fishermen in this bill but I do so cautiously as I am not currently affiliated in any way and did not offer these comments as a representative of any group but my personal observations. I was a participant many years in a Washington DC forum where there were many government bureaucrats and PhD type economists from academia. It was an honest and sincere discussion about the economic plight of commercial fishermen in the United States and one of the professors asked me if a guaranteed minimum wage would be a help to fishing families. I answered that question with a resounding “no” and said that such policy would destroy them. As much as fishermen themselves complain about the prices they get paid for fish, it’s the thrill of the hunt and the unknown that drives them. They have no idea when they leave the dock what their payout for that trip will be or if they will have a payout at all. Add to that the uncertain weather conditions that may threaten the success of the trip or even their safety and you have individuals that have a love-hate relationship with this unusual way of life. It’s the unknown that seems to drive them and in my opinion, in the last true bastion of free enterprise that we have. They love it when prices are high and hate it when they aren’t. Again, I cannot speak currently for fishermen but when I was approached with a suggestion like payments to fishermen if the state bans a particular gear, bans nets or any other scheme, it was simply this. The commercial fishing families are not for sale. In summation I have strong thoughts as a seafood consumer. This is a public trust resource and as such, belongs to everyone. I have some news for both commercial and recreational fishermen. I do not fish at all and I am part of the vast majority in this state, as well as our nation. As part owner of an excellent source of protein, I object to making any food source available to a very small segment of our population and taking it away from the majority of its owners. It’s really simple really. In 1997, we were told emphatically that the greatest benefit to fishermen for the Fisheries Reform Act would be that the general assembly would delegate rule making authority to the Marine Fisheries Commission and allow the rules and regulations to be set by deliberative body that knew fishing so that we didn’t have to run to Raleigh to fight the battles. So here we are running to Raleigh. One could say I have no dog in this fight since I am neither…

…for recreation or commercial fishermen, and that is true. I can’t or won’t eat my beagle. But I do have a cow in this fight and don’t really want or need another needy beagle. So I’ll respectfully suggest that you scuttle this bill. I’ll leave you with this note. I’ve had many conversations over the years about what it was like to be a lobbyist with the frequently held notion that politics stinks, so how can you stand it. I answer with this. Several years ago I was headed to this building for a committee meeting and stopped for fuel for my diesel pickup in Kinston. It was a very hot, humid day and I pulled under the truck canopy to fuel up. Shortly after I started to fuel a garbage truck pulled up at the pump next to me. It was quite smelly with some liquidy gunk dripping from the back. My Quarter Pounder with cheese that I had just eaten suddenly got sour. Then I thought, “This garbage truck smells like Limburger cheese. I like Limburger cheese,” and then all was right with the world again. In these discussions let’s all learn to like Limburger cheese so that this process won’t make us sick. I have some Limburger cheese, Mr. Chairman. Thanks and God bless. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you for the opportunity to provide some comments. Before I provide my comments it is my prayer that the facts and concerns of the citizens of our great state will help you folks discern the truth and do what is right, just and fair for the people that you all have the honor to represent. My name is Jess Hawkins, I was born, raised and currently live in Eastern North Carolina. I worked my 30-year professional career as a public servant with the North Carolina Division of Marine Fisheries as a fisheries biologist and a manager. Recreational fishing is my main hobby and I love to consume seafood. I am speaking as a North Carolinian and I am not a paid representative of any group. While I’m proud to be called a North Carolinian, I’m deeply disturbed and even angry that my state is considering allocating a public trust natural resource to a small proportion of North Carolina’s population when there is no scientific or conservation reason and questionable economic benefit to do so and in the thoughts of many people is unjust and unfair. North Carolina is not like other coastal states. It is unique. It has more estuary water than any other state in the US, hundreds of miles of barrier islands, thousands of miles of coastline. These waters have supported and continue to support valuable commercial and recreational fisheries through the history of our state. Its commercial fisheries are still primarily small, family-owned businesses that are renowned for the harvest of different types of seafood. Its recreational fisheries are some of the best in the nation. Ranking number three in our country in 2011 in number of anglers and also number three for the number of fish caught in 2011. Our state is also number two in the number of angler trips along the Atlantic Coast. These data do exclude Texas, California and Alaska because they do not use the same type surveys as the rest of our states in our nation do. Reallocation of speckled trout, red drums and striped bass is not about protecting resources or about conservation. The striped bass population in Albemarle Sound is healthy and has been since 1997. The population situations of striped bass in the Neuse and Pamlico are unknown but restrictions have been put in place to make those populations sustainable. Fishermen are not overfishing our red drum population. It is a world class fishery. Measures have been put in place to restore the health of the speckled trout resource. In fact recreational catches this past fall and spring were some of the highest seen by anglers in many years. The commercial fisheries for these species occur up and down our coast and have many restrictions such as strict harvest limits, gear restrictions, these are mainly on gill nets, on where and how those nets can be placed. In fact red drum can only be commercially landed as incidental catch when fishing for other fish as is also the case for striped bass in Albemarle Sound. By reallocating these species totally to recreational fishermen, the result will be in many instances, dead drum, dead trout or dead striped bass that will be caught in commercial fishermen’s gear. These fish could be sold and eaten by consumers but now must be thrown overboard. That would make no sense. These fisheries’ resources are conserved through a process established by Republicans and Democrats in the General Assembly called the Fishery Reform Act 1997. The Act required the state and requires the state to develop fishery management plans with the advice of scientists, recreational and commercial fishermen, have public input and meetings on those plans, and to have those plans reviewed by the General Assembly.

Before the Marine Fishery Commission passes it all these species have fishery management plans and non recommended allocating these resources to a sole user group neither promotional or recreational to establish that these fish belong solely to recreational fisherman would be inconsistent with the general assembly's own fishery reform act in terms of process and in terms of providing balance access to its public trust resources. These species are held and managed by the state as a public trust resource for the benefit of all North Carolina citizens. Our general statutes and constitution convey unlike some other states that they are natural resources that are held in trust by the state for the benefit of its people in common. I am proud that our state adheres to the public trust doctrine which came from our English founders in common law to keep vital fishing navigation and commercial rights from the greed and corruption of that era. To reallocate this public trust resource to a user group that represents only 3 to 5% of the states population when there is no conservation need is unfair and wrong it would be like restricting our beaches and sounds to only a small minority group of a certain social economic class. Reallocating these resources for recreational fisherman only deny consumers and people that do not own a boat or can get to the water access to the public trust resource there seems to be no reason to take such an action besides selfishness and greed. Instead I envision a state that will continue to allow its citizens access to these fish resources as long as those resources are not endangered whether it be through hook and line fishing being caught by commercial fisherman being bought at a retail fish market or eaten at a restaurant thank you for the opportunity to speak to you. [SPEAKER CHANGES]. Thank You. Good afternoon my name is Chuck Lockridge I am a resident of Parker's Island a CCA State Board Member, I'm a past coach head of the first stripped bass advisory committee to the state of North Carolina saw fit to do and Terry Pratt and I which I don't know if Terry's here we basically both pretty much saved the stripped bass for all the rest of y'all that's Terry's line and he asked me to say that wherever I am. I'd like to address one thing and that is that the state of North Carolina by default has to manage all of our public trust resources whether their human, natural or physical all of our resources that are there for the state to manage we've got to manage them properly. You can sit back all day long and talk to folks about how to manage a public trust resource but the bottom line is the state by default must must manage these public trust resources to provide the highest total economic return to the state of North Carolina and the tax payers there in if we do not do that we have provided either a direct or an indirect subsidy to which ever user group is not providing that highest total economic return. That said I'd like to move on to address what the fisheries reform act has been referred to as basically everything that we can imagine to manage fisheries in North Carolina. The fisheries reform act was an outstanding piece of law making that was done by outstanding folks in very contentious times much like these. But I'll also remind you that the fisheries reform act has been superseded by legislation almost every year since it was enforced some of the latest of those would be the Midhaven fishing bill that was passed into law that was basically supported by senator Raven and the rest of the senate and the house its now law. We also have a super majority vote of the marine fisheries commission to over ride the division of the marine fisheries on any on any piece of management that involves fish that are over fished or experiencing over-fishing so while the fisheries reform act is there and this bill maybe HB983 may be inconsistent with that as soon as its passed into law the position of the North Carolina Division of Marine Fisheries and the Marine Fisheries commission will be to support that just as strongly as they have supported the fisheries reform act of 97. They support state statutes that's their job and I believe the Marine Fisheries Commission takes an oath to do so. We have seen in the last week an initial review done by the fine folks at NCBMF and Dr. Daniels but basically we're looking at a review that was requested by a legislator I think Representative George Cleveland asked some questions and he got a tremendous response I know Lewis well occasionally I see him in church whenever I go he attends much more regularly than I do I usually go Mother's Day, Christmas and a day to be named later but Lewis is there quite a bit and i think if you'll sit back and

Ask him the questions about inconsistent with FRA 97 and going to be supportive once it becomes state statute. I think you’ll see that. So let’s get onto the Game Fish Portion of 983. There is no biological evidence that supports game fish. There is absolutely no data to oppose it. This is not a biological bill. So all of the biological data, all of the biological pie chats and bar graphs do not apply to this bill. This is an economic bill. The Marine Economic Development Act. It will be heard in Commerce and the House, and mostly likely will pass to the Senate and be heard in Commerce there. This is not an economic, I mean this is an economic bill. So it’s not biology that’s driving this. It’s not having units taken out of the water, it’s not having efforts reduced by commercial fishermen. That all deals with biology. There is not one biological piece in HB 983. Not one. There is also no net ban mentioned in HB 983. So whether you’re thinking about today, if that comes 5 or 10 years down the road, keep those arguments because you might need them again. But it won’t come from CCA anytime soon. CCA’s Executive Board actually offered a more touring in a meeting called by Senator Tillman in ??. Some of you here might have sat in on that. It was mentioned and basically just shot down immediately so we could go back to talk about bridges, bridging inlets and paving Highway 12. We sent about 4 hours doing that. ??’s an important number because we’d ask for a meeting with commercial fishermen to negotiate and compromise and see what we could find as common ground for 4 years and that’s as close as we ever got. So hopefully we’ll have some time after the public comments sessesion to talk to folks and take advantage of being able to talk with reasonable, calm, cool, collected minds. I want to remind you now that there are seven states, Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Florida, Georgia and South Carolina that have all already gone down the path that we are on today. As we go down this path we get to see any one of those 7 states who are led by good, fiscally conservative, Christian Republican Governors. If you think any of one of those Governors, the likes of Rick Perry and Bobby Jindal would basically do something that would hurt their state economically, I think you’re wrong. Absolutely wrong. They know the economics of what game fish can do. They know the economics of what’s good for their state. So it’s no doubt that this is the way that North Carolina should go and we should be the 8th state to embrace this. I’ll leave you now with a written statement. So while I’m not here to debate the biological data, the proud heritage of commercial fishing, consumption of seafood, or even the emotional rhetoric surrounding HB 983. And we can debate and refute all of it if you like. HB 983 is an economic development bill that will be passed and made into law because it its irrefutable the best choice for the state and all of its citizens. The morning after HB 983 passes, and is signed into law by Governor McCrory, the state of North Carolina will be on a road already traveled by every state from Texas to South Carolina, to creating 6.5 times more jobs, 12. 5 times more income than the state realized without game fish status for red?? Spotted sea trout and estuary ranged trout bass. We’ll add at a minimum an additional 12 million dollars of total economic return to the state and every commercial fisherman, whether a 4th generation fisherman or one brand spanking new to the industry will be able to catch and sell to consumers both in and outside North Carolina’s borders, 99.1% of the salt water public trust resources as they did the day before this bill was passed . There is no question about that. We’re talking about having commercial fisherman maintain the heritage that you’re so proud of. We’re talking about doing what’s best for the state of north Carolina and we’re talking about what’s best for the tax payers f the state. Again I’ll repeat, the day after HB 983 is passed into law, signed by the Governor, every commercial fisherman that fished the day before will be able to fish for 99.1% of those fish the day after. Consumers will be able to consume 99.1% of the same fish they consumed the day.

Before this bill becomes law. North Carolina must, must, manage all of our resources. Human, fiscal and natural to the best of their ability to provide the highest total economic return to the state of North Carolina. If they do not they are remiss in their duties and handing out subsidies directly or indirectly to a user group that does not do that. I thank you very much. Good day. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. Before our next presenter I would like to remind everybody that please keep your facial gestures to yourself and be respectful to speakers that are speaking in front of you. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] My name is Ray Brown, I'm a native of Bartick [SP] county and I currently live in Goldsborough. I have friends on both sides of this argument so my views and comments today will be limited to my personal beliefs. And those friends include as I thought about it, the three gentlemen who spoke before me. All three I consider and have called friends for a long period of time. If the average North Carolina citizen go to the coast and without too much trouble catch a mess of adult spot, [??], trout, flounder, red fish or whatever, like they did 40 years ago, we wouldn't be here today. But they aren't able to do that now and haven't been able to do that for a long time. And if you're not one that fishes recreationally for those of you who are not on either side of the argument, then I encourage you to talk to someone who does and talk to someone who's old enough to remember what those waters once were. Game fish is not about taking fish from one user group and giving it to another. If that was the case, and I've been in favor of game fish at least three species for over 30 years, if that was the case I would be against it. Game fish is about changing the way we manage these fish completely. It is as former governor of Louisiana Edwin Edwards said when asked if his state was going to reopen red drum for wild harvest, and I quote, "Why? Our waters have been brimming with wild red drum that drive Anglos [??] from not only throughout Louisiana but other states. At night we feed them black and red fish grown in our own fish farms. never have we utilized our fish stocks economically as well as we do today." I'm a native of Eastern Northern Carolina. I grew up eating salt herring and collards and washed away my troubles in and on the Chowan river. She's a partial provider of food in my youth, a babysitter in my teenage years, and I still turn to her sometimes when I just need to get away. But we should not allow history to be rewritten today. we know that right now only 149 people caught and sold more than $2000 dollars worth of these three fish and in the waters in North Carolina last year from DMF trip tickets. If they're not true then it brings up the whole validity of the DMF trip ticket system which is a path I'm sure most of you don't want to go down. But that's not an aberration. In other words it's not because of rules, regulation or whatervrt that this is a small number of people. In 1976 an individual named Connie Pervis wrote for the DMS a report on the Pamlico Sound, and when it go to red drum it said the following, red drum are not considered to be of great importance as a commercial fish but are highly regarded as a recreational fish. That was written 40 years ago. I am glad this bill compensates those individuals who may have to give up income. It reminds me of what my family received when we had to give up raising tobacco. If you as a legislature came to Raleigh because you felt compelled to reverse overspending by state government then you should embrace game fish. It is to overfishing what a true balanced budget is to overspending. And that I'm sure you understand. But you also understand to balance a budget you must stay on task and not be sidetracked by objections that are constantly raised to keep you from staying focused. If you...

get called up into side arguments, those that would have the state continue to live in the deficit world would have won. We are once again left with deficit spending. With a fishery, it's termed overfishing, and if you look at these fish stocks today, the DMF website, speckled trout's depleted, red drum is recovering, striped bass is listed as recovering, but then, if you go to the WRC website, you will see that they are now concerned that the striped bass population in the Albemarle system is perhaps the lowest it's been in ten years. It's not about taking fish from one user group to the other. It's about re-managing the way we do this, so that our fish will be more numerous in the water, bigger fish. We're not taking fish away from anyone. We're putting it on the same level as the view from the top- the Cape Hatteras light. It's always there. It's protected, but to use it, you've gotta go see it yourself. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. Next we have Representative Tom Murray come to actually go through the bill with everybody. While he's getting started, I'd like for everyone to give special recognition to our sergeant at arms: Mike Clampett, Charles Goodwin, B.H. Powell, Carl Morello, Doug Harris, and Barry Moore. Thank you for your service today. Representative Moore. I mean Murray; excuse me. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you, Representative Bell. I appreciate your willingness to chair this, and I appreciate the attendance of everybody. I think we generated a fair amount of interest in this legislation, as it does every time it gets brought up, and that is the primary reason why I decided to engage in the negotiation in this legislation. It's an issue that continually presents itself before the legislature, and, eventually, recreational fisherman will get game fish status. It's going to happen in the state of North Carolina, and so my goal was to try to represent a negotiation and get a balanced solution to issues that present itself to the fisheries, not just as one user group as an interest in game fish status, but what can we do to make sure that we have a vibrant commercial industry in North Carolina, as well, and, as one legislator told me who's interested in this issue, he said, Tom, if you'll just ten years. If you just wait ten years, there won't be a commercial fishing industry, and this issue will just go away, and that bothers me. That bothers me because of the history of our state with your industry, and so I wanted to try to address this in a way that seemed fair and balanced. So, in part one, we have the designation of coastal game fish, we have the three species that we are designating in addition to mitigation payments for anyone who experiences any losses. The recreational fishing license increases were recommended directly from the Wildlife resources Commission. There is an additional bill that has been filed that deals with increased license fees across the board that were recommended by Wildlife Resources. I'm a primary sponsor of that legislation as well, but this addresses simply the recreational fishing license specific to coastal fishing, recreational fishing licenses. In part two, we address an issue that has come to my attention that there is a lack of observers for commercial fishing to be able to prosper in our state, and, while that's not a state regulation, I'm willing to fund observer programs with state dollars to help make sure that we have a robust observer program so you can continue to fish. Part three of the legislation deals with funding for dredging of shallow draft navigation channels. The payment mechanism comes from boat gas taxes. There is a identifiable portion of gas taxes collected in our state that are directly attributable to boats, and so this would reallocate a portion. One half of one percent of the amount is used to fund shallow draft dredging funds, so, those are the four major pieces of the legislation, isn't by far perfect, but it is what I want to hear from especially the commercial fishing industry

our state specific issues that can be mitigated through this type of legislation to keep your industry vibrant with the full knowledge that game fish is on the table and eventually you could get a game fish status with no commercial input and that would bother me as a legislator if it wasn't about this piece of legislation. So, I’m hearing Wake County, I think I’m trying to bring a balanced approach, a way to address both sides of the equation with the full knowledge that eventually, at some point in our state that we will have game fish designation and I think you need to take that as a given, because it's going to happen. All the other states that have game fish status they preceded game fish status with a net ban. That's not the right way to go about it either. So every other state that has game fish status they started with a net ban then they went to game fish status that’s not, that’s not the right way to go about it and so I’m trying to bring a balanced approach this. I appreciate your interest and I appreciate your willingness to come to Raleigh and let us hear from you it doesn't happen a lot down here especially with this kind of robust participation and I sincerely appreciate your attendance and I’m hopeful that will have a productive discussion, with all the givens that we have in place to help make sure that we have balanced legislation that benefits all parties. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Ladies and gentlemen next we’re going to get into the public comments. Everyone will have up to two minutes. Please keep your comments in that time frame. We do have a number of people that would like to address the group. We’re going to go ahead and get started. Ladies and gentlemen please remember to respect the speakers and also please hold your applause. We’re going to try to get through this is as quick as possible. Due to the large number of people that would like to speak. So we’ll go ahead and get started. Once we get through the first sheet I’ll read the next list of names. Once your name is read whether you’re in this room or if you’re in the conference room below please come up we’ll line up on the side here and each person will have two minutes to address a group. Thank you. Sammy Corbet we’ll start with you and then we’ll go right down the line. And we’ll have ?? good. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I’d like to thank everybody for giving me this chance to speak today. My name’s Sammy Corbet. I represent Hampstead ?? Beach area and the commercial fisherman, thirty eight years. I sit on the Southern advisory committee. It used to be the southeast. On there for ten terms now I’ve also been on the ??, sea mullet, blue crab, definition of commercial fisherman and sea turtle committees. There’s people from recreational sector that would like to have you believe there is no benefit to commercial fisherman, from catching speckled trout, red drum. I personally 12 to 15 percent of my income just from them. At 12 percent, 15 percent I can pay my mortgage with that for the whole year. So I don’t think there’s anybody in this crowd that thinks they could have part of their income that pays their mortgage for a year taken away from them and still make it. I don’t care what you make or where you live. In 38 years of commercial fishing I’ve never sat in on a meeting or a group of guys talking where they said you know what we need to get those guys with the rod and reels out of here. Their catching too many fish. Their hooking fish and killing them. They got to be gone. But every time I get around recreational fishermen, time to get rid of the commercial fisherman catching our speckled trout and our red drum. I think that the marine fisheries does a fantastic job with what they, I mean with the size limits, the bag limits I don’t know how you can get a fairer system than what they’ve got. I see a lot of people in the recreation side that I sit in committees with. We all sit down; we hash out the problems to go before the commission. They hash out problems they have. We come up with a great plan. Every fish we’ve had a plan on is better off now than it was the day the plan was put into effect. I respect all of you. Thank you for your time and I really think you need to leave it to the marine fishermen. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Once again when your name’s called if you’d just start lining up here so we can go through it a bit faster and I once again I ask that there be no applause at the end. Thank you and when you do approach the podium, please notify yourself

For a wallet and with good column a commercial fish and 40 years of marriage of this season, and they appreciate this opportunity: medicine legislature and people here, today this public forum , Denmark and warm situations Texas opposition to the dangers bill HP, 83 we heard enough about fugard future economic projections potential catches the larger doll values of the stairs masataka consistent fashion is today as high for legal issues concerning HP 93 general assembly adopted fishers reform act of 1997 or states to outlaw from national car special fish and reenter the spec states and journals; recognizing the duplicate or coastal fishing resources into Boston commercial and recreational counters and better management of these resources pack also requires a marine fisheries commission before 5:00 shadow regulation of commercial and recreational fishing groups in the interest of public education official position statement of dns for house bill 983 recently released states at least 1 yards from the fish and perform at the ms-stakes resources to the benefit of all user groups that includes recreational and commercial fishermen and also the consumer welfare law as a strong public trust doctrine as the pain of the ms the coastal fisheries board of all citizens of our state allocation of any stocks to one user group has proposed an HP 93 as bob Ellis commercial and recreational interests will heal this action is your standards of these resources that he went astray Foster of matters upgrade the alcohol sleep, bush downfalls was ours?? (SPEAKER CHANGES) North Carolina Russian participation people shore fishing I've heard members of the CC A's say that most of the couture only interested in heritage of businesses 76 years old and some business economists have to be emotional room 260 mile to give a holler them to buy the albatross first mistake, have never a lot of the community of nations which are and Marshall, composition and bill as a second, then here's the RS, few years ago regarding the fishing license with four fishing license that would stop smoking ban on that day the CCA and environmental defense fund they supported the commercial of the of saltwater fishing license and the idea of an oversight you; this is a member of our decision should be on data they only way to walk the Sierra two stealth those recommended that we would buy it was said by this movie would have been trying to happen to me that the license soul is lavished on the banning of last year we sold or 135 selection that some kind of data that you been provided, suggest you take a long article and get the years after the economic demands of the ritual when you have these men of this action off the walls and I would like to fight the ANC legislature for?? (SPEAKER CHANGES)this meeting and adults North Carolina Systems from opportunity to voice an opinion about a public resources should be allocated by Dennis Moore as toll from over, Collins, part of a commercial fisherman of fulton's to advance the state is studying fisheries lines by friend and colleague David cone cannot attend to family illness the estimated two rabies, since the ??..............

on Ocracoke Island the fishing tradition is directly related to the tourism industry producing seafood for restaurants and retail purchases bait for tackle shops, as well as promoting the fishing village image. Many tourist say Ocracoke would not be the same without the fish house. Tourists come to the Outer Banks, not only from natural beauty but also for the fishing to catch and eat seafood from Corolla to calabash, access to fresh seafood is essential to tourism industry and to the local economy of fishing communities. Game fish status threatens the very core of our fishing economy even though landings may be low in volume these fish provide essential income during the late fall and winter and early spring months when options for income are the hardest to find. During summer our retail staff is constantly asked when you'll have red drum, and when we can reserve some. Most fishermen on Ocracoke are also seafood dealers. They supply every restaurant Ocracoke with fresh fish, and red drum speckled trout and striped bass are perennial favorites. These fish have high name recognition and the restaurants that have them on their menu are more profitable. Thank you for your opportunity to speak. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Ladies and gentlemen ?? , president of the North Carolina Watermen United. Got a little something I want to read from you. Wherever we need to start from then God said let us make man in our image, according to our likeness and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle, and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth. God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him, male and female he created them. God blessed them, and God said to them, be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth and subdue it and rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over every living thing that moves on the earth, Now when to juxtapose that with a meeting that I attended with a couple of your speakers here today, Representative Murray and Representative Moffitt. Representative Murray we will not have game fish status in the state of North Carolina. We will not subjugate our working-class people to second class citizenship. I was overcome like a nauseous wave of bile that Rose in my throat after the meeting in which I attended with these two gentlemen who try to tell us that we needed to reinvent ourselves. I looked at a man whose fish that he had eaten previously and said you need to reinvent yourself and I got up that morning and I read instruct those who are rich in this present world not to be conceited or fix their hope on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly supplies us with all things to enjoy instruct them to do good to be rich in good works, to be generous, and ready to share storing up for themselves treasures of a great foundation for the future so that they may take hold of that which is life indeed. Guard what has been entrusted to you, avoiding worldly and empty chatter, and the opposing argument of what is falsely called knowledge. [SPEAKER CHANGES] If we have any more applause I’ll clear the room and only allow speakers in please be respectful thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thanks for having me. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I’m Dan Odin I’m a fourth generation owner, operator of Odin’s dock in Hatteras Village and without doing complicated math equation I feel like I can safely say that 50 percent of my sales at Odin’s dock come from commercial fishing. Therefore, fifty percent of my sales come from recreational fishing as well many of my customers spend half of their doing each a lot of the guys in this room, a lot of recreational guys are not here, but taking a portion of income from commercial activity from the fisherman and from my business will also take a substantial amount of tax revenue from the state of North Carolina. I'm afraid that Hatteras Village could be one of the first coastal

Communities to tally fall a part from the impact. The impact of some thing like the game fish bill. North Carolina is a very unique state, whit its own unique residents. I don't think that there is any body in this room that could deny, that this is a stepping stone for net ban. I feel very strong about it, this is not Florida, the residents in this room are not from Florida. And what has worked for Florida will not work for coastal North Carolina. The coastal and sea towns simply can not stand game fish bill or a net ban. I don't really do the science side, I listen to it, and I feel like the division of marine fisheries does a decent job regulating stock. And I appreciate you guys giving me a minute of your time. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I am Lily Eden the co-owner of the of The Vista by the Sea in More Head city, since may 1993. we had built our reputation on fresh and local sea food. I'm a founding board member of caught rate catch and a member of the sea food program, promoted through the department of North Carolina department of agriculture. In 2006 our restaurant earn the best dish of North Carolina for a caught rate grouper, and sea ?? with dose souse. We track our selves thought the contest and I was amazed at our selves, increase over 200%. with the growing demand of our cough rate dishes we have tried to educate our selves and our clientèle about about the seasonality of sea food. We have tried to contact law makers directly. I included there names and information in our feature sheet. For the past winter months we were thank full. We were able to serve red drum and stripe bass. Since there were restriction on groupers and other sea food until may first. In 2011 tourist spent 18 billion dollars in North Carolina. At the North Carolina sea food festival, cough rate catch did a survey to find out what brought them to the coast. The highest percentage said they came to eat our local fresh sea food. Thus, the development of the Cristal Cost culinary campaign by the DTDA. According to the national restaurant association, on of the biggest trend in food industry is locally source products. Our customers whan to, what conditions and who cought and raised their food, they are consuming. I need to ask you two questions. Number one why would you possibly pass a bill eliminating the majority of the public access to red drum stripe bass and spotted sea-trout when the North Carolina department of acg has done such a fantastic job to promote North Carolina sea food. Number two if you vote in favor of this bill are you ready to take full responsibility, for actions and consequences surrounding your vote. Possibly the sinking North Carolina commercial fishing industry. Thus, grooving the dependence of imported sea food. In closing I restate my name. My name is Lilly Eton. A cretin American adopty, an American citizen and grateful of the opportunities that this great nation and state has given me. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Good afternoon representative. I thank you for the opportunity to speak on behalf of the sea food industry today. My name is Alison Thomson Willis, I ma a native of Rayleigh but live on harkers island North Carolina. My husband Edy Willis is a forth generation commercial fisher man. We own and operate mister big sea food maker and and courts town sea food. A community supported sea food program that delivers fresh local sea food to customers, restaurants and specialty markets in durum, tapo hill, Carrboro and Boon. Red drum, sparkle trout, and stripped bass, are three of our most requested fin fish. All tree are high demand item in restaurant, specialty markets and our CSS program. The demand for this species far out wights the supply. The landings might be low per fisherman, but the product is vital to our fisherman year round income. All tree fin fish are high dollar item for local fisherman. The high dollar item flows trough the supply chain to the consumer. For example a fisherman receives two dollars per pound for red drum at the fish house. As compared to fifty cents per pound for blue fish. By the time the drum is sold, in a specialty market in Topal hill. Those red drum files are worth 14 to 15 dollars per pound. The proposed game fish designation comes at a time when the public desire for healthy local food is at an all time high. Our customer care deeply where there food comes from, and how their sea food got from the water to their plate. Our customers want fresh wild cough sea food. They do not want to consume farm raised sea food.

instead of imported from the other side of the world under questionable conditions. They want and deserve to know that the red drum they are eating tonight was caught yesterday by Aaron ?? of Cedar Island. If HB 983 passes, speckled trout, red drum, and striped bass will be forever off the menu at restaurants on the coast and inland. These select, wild caught fish will be forever off the dinner plates of our customers and seafood consumers statewide, who enjoy the culinary treasures our fishermen provide all North Carolinians. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES]. Thank you for this opportunity to speak on this very important matter. I'm John Day, and while I live in Saxapahaw, my family settled on Cedar Island in the 1790's. Many of them are still there today, some of them preserving the legacy of ancestors by making a living on the water as fisherman. I'm a retired county manager, so I know firsthand of the importance of economic development, retaining and creating jobs, strengthening communities, and perhaps most importantly, honoring and supporting heritage and culture. Now I work for North Carolina State University on a USDA funded project with a goal of bringing more North Carolina grown and caught foods into mainstream retail grocery stores and food service industry's supply chains that serve Fort Bragg. If the project succeeds, it'll improve food security by increasing access to North Carolina foods and it will strengthen the economic viability of small and mid-sized farm and fishing operations. I'm also involved in other North Carolina State efforts to grow and strengthen community food systems, and by extension, the state food system. These efforts are largely driven by the burgeoning market for local foods. More and more consumers want to buy food from outlets where they can see who grew or who caught their food, and the want to spend their food dollars in a way that supports their local and their state economies. They want the freedom to buy local food from people that they know. HB 983 runs counter to these values and efforts. By designating red drum, speckled trout, and striped bass as game fish, families will be hurt because their incomes will be reduced, jobs may be lost, communities weakened, and the heritage and culture of our proud coastal fishing communities will be diminished. Less, not more, North Carolina food will be available to move into the supply chains that feed grocery store customers and soldiers at Fort Bragg. Finally, and most importantly, a precedent will be set, where one class of citizens is given favor and privilege over another. One having access to a food that is strictly managed, publicly owned resource, another denied it. I respectfully ask for the removal of game fish provisions from HB 983. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES]. Before our next speaker, please listen for your name. Bill Hooper, Adam Tyler, Kenny Rustic, Karen Patrick, Jess Hawkins, Libby Eaton, Willie Phillips, Keith Bruno, Morton Gaskell. If you'll please come to the side here, and wait in line. Thank you. Please continue. [SPEAKER CHANGES]. My name is Ashley Blue. I come as a representative from Greenville, North Carolina. I'm the owner of Shore to Door Seafood. I've spent the last 4 years of my life promoting Carteret and Pamlico County seafood. I'm here to speak to you based on the myth of aqua culture being a clear substitute for this fishery and this bill. In speaking with several people down in Louisiana as fish farmers themselves, and asking them point blank, are they able to counter this measure and are able to obtain the necessary means to be able to overcome on a supply chain's shock of this nature. Right out of their mouths, point blank, they are regulated to the hilt, just like we are. They're being pointed out as being fishermen, but they're really farmers. As being farmers, they're dealing with regulation based on point-source discharge of their ponds these fish are raised in. Anybody's not sure what point-source discharge, we can go back to the hog lagoons. Their water that they raise these fish in are being classified as the same classification as toxic water in hog lagoons. They're not able to dump this water into blue line ditches. I asked many places around North Carolina, as The Fish Connection, and other striped bass farmers, they're experiencing the same issues. They do not have the infrastructure that is needed to sustain this supply shock, which in turn will make striped bass and red drum

On your plates, at your restaurants, more expensive that what beef or pork could ever cost. So with that, the substitutes being too high, I do urge you very much to kill this bill. Thank you very much for your time. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Good afternoon. I’m Jamie Rival. I live in Derrick County, and I’d like to let you know who regulates North Carolina fisheries. The department’s council’s acts compacts administrations and services that manage, rule, write, regulate, permit and enforce North Carolina’s fisheries management plans. Plans that must be in place before any fish of significance is kept, sold or eaten. These bureaucracies are the United States Congress, the US Department of Commerce, the US Secretary of Commerce, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, National Marine Fisheries Service, the Office of Protected Resources, Highly Migratory Species, the Northeast Fisheries Science Center, Department of Homeland Security, Department of Transportation, US Fish and Wildlife Service, United States Coast Guard, Mid-Atlantic Fishery Management Council, South Atlantic Fishery Management Council, the Atlantic States Marine Fisheries Commission. Our own state also makes rules and regulations that are under the Department of Environment and Natural Resources and North Carolina Division of Marine Fisheries. Some examples of state regulation are gear restriction, net attendance time closures and area closures. Many state regulations are put in place to comply with federal FMPs, Endangered Species Act, and the Office of Protected Resources rules. I would like to sum up by reiterating the fact that no one in North Carolina can legally keep or eat a fish until tens of thousands of biologists, scientists, lawyers, bureaucrats, government appointees, advisors, elected officials, marine fishery staff, statisticians, the general public on agencies, commissions, compacts, advisory boards, department services rules advisory teams, stock assessment rules committees, scoping meeting councils, stock assessment workshops, stock assessment committees, biological studies to prove sustainable committees, technical committees, monitoring committees, FMP development and review teams approve the FMP. The state and federal entities listed in this report all have the same goal. To include conservation and management measures that will provide the greatest overall benefit to the state, particularly with respect to food production. And finally, the General Assembly of North Carolina sends [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] citizens from our state [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] to represent North Carolina on these federal councils. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you Mr. Chairman and Representatives, thank you. My name is Warren Judge. I’m chairman of the Derrick County Board of Commissioners. We’re blessed in Derrick County to have an abundant fishing industry. Three segments. All three segments are alive and well in our county. Our commercial fishermen, hundreds. Hundreds, thousands of jobs from the boats to the men and women on the boats to the docks to the fish houses to cut rooms, to the tractor trailers that leave, carrying our catch north to Richmond and Washington, D.C., Baltimore, and New York City. Taking good, local, fresh seafood and spreading it across the great country of ours. This is an economic question, and being on the ground in Derrick County, it smacks of taking fish from one sector to another. It’s about jobs. In this legislature, we’ve heard for the last several years about economic stimulus and creating jobs. Let’s not lose the jobs we have. All of our people work hard at fishing. Our recreational fishing provides jobs. Our charter boat industry provides jobs. But let’s not decide to pick on the commercial fishing industry and take those jobs from us. We appreciate everybody that fishes in the sea. They’re our farmers, and we need to keep them working. And we need to, these are the backbone of America. These are hardworking men and women, families, children to raise. You can’t take a public trust resource, take it from somebody, give it to somebody else. We look for y’all to oppose this legislation and if there’s negotiation on the table, let’s open it up. I would put myself forward as someone to negotiate. But let’s not be unilateral in this. Let’s not take one resource from one group and give it to another. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] My name is Bill Looper, I’m from Carter County, North Carolina. I’m here to

speak against House Bill 983. I'd like to ask our legislators a question as I open, do the proponents of this bill that is before us know what is best for our state in these circumstances even better than the North Carolina division of Marine Fisheries, the state agency that our state has tasked with studying, managing and regulating these public trust resources. You see, what the advocates of House Bill 983 are failing to tell us about is their support of state wide net bands. The reality is if any, or all three of these species are designated as game fish, the division of Marine Fisheries explains, and I quote, "it will result in increased discards because these fish will still be inadvertently caught in commercial gear used to catch other species of fish. Any game fish taken as by catch by commercial fisherman will have to be discarded resulting in waste. Additionally the discards will likely create new conflicts between the recreational and commercial user groups." And I think we need to highlight that last sentence. The CCA's website list their achievements in other states. We've printed these out, so that all of us have access to something that they boast about. I want you to understand that there is a direct correlation between game fish status and net bands. Nationally the CCA boast that they've already helped to establish net bands in four other states. Now pause for a moment and consider this, the same group that is asking today for game fish status, will return tomorrow and demand that you do something about all the game fish that are inadvertently being caught in gill nets resulting in unnecessary waste. A year from now observer data will support their claim and you'll be faced with a greater dilemma. I urge you to defeat it such passion and enthusiasm and never bears repeating again. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I would ask that you would stay within the time limit to be fair to everybody else that wants to speak. The sergeant at arms will hold up when you have one minute left and then when you stop would you just finish your sentence. Thank You. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Good morning legislators, my name is Adam Tyler from Carteret County North Carolina. I would like to give you a little bit of facts behind making this game fish go through. According to the population of North Carolina 2010 there were 9,535,483 people. According to the license data collected by DMF, there are a total of 439,251 in and out of state licenses issued. This is roughly about three to four percent of our state population. In essence, if Phil's bill passes less than five percent of the people will have access to these wild caught species of fish, so can a legislator allow a group of individuals to push for making these fish game fish and take them from all the consumers in North Carolina? I thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you for your time. My name is Kenny Rustic and I'm a resident of Carteret County. I make my living as a full time commercial fisherman since 1985. House Bill 983 is being introduced under the disguise of economics. The Coastal Conservation Association is saying that recreational fishing generates more revenue than commercial fishing. This may be true, but I cannot understand why one group, one user group thinks they deserve sole use of a public trust resource. Not all recreational fisherman support House Bill 983, it is a small percentage. I am a licensed recreational fisherman along with my wife and stepson. We all oppose House Bill 983. The North Carolina Constitution states in Article 1, Section 1, The Equality and Rights of Persons, "We hold it self-evident that all persons are created equal with certain inalienable rights and among these are life, liberty and the enjoyment of the fruits of their own labor and the pursuit of happiness." Article 14, Section 5, Conservation of Natural Resources, "It shall be the policy of this state to conserve and protect its lands and waters for the benefits of all its citizenry." The definition of inalienable rights on Dictionary.com says, "a right that cannot be taken away, denied or transferred." The preamble to the 1997 fisheries reformat, section 1997-400 states, "The general assembly recognizes the need to protect our coastal fishery resource

and to balance the commercial and recreational interest through better management of these resources. and also requires the marine fisheries commission to provide fair regulation of commercial and recreational groups in the interest of the public. i would like to ask you as representatives of this citizens of north carolina, are you willing to pass house bill 983, knowing it will be a departure from the mandates of 1997 fisheries reform act. [SPEAKER CHANGES] thank you [SPEAKER CHANGES] bye ???? [SPEAKER CHANGES] hello, my name is karen patrick. i'm a recreational fisherman. a small business owner, a consumer of north Carolina seafood purchased from north carolina seafood dealers and restaurants and a supporter of commercial fisherman. i strongly oppose house bill 983 because i believe that a public resource as the three fish considered in this bill are should be available to the public and not a select few. im not in favor of the social engineering that this bill would mandate in the name of fisheries management. i dont believe in big government and the impediments it can place on a small business owner i believe the positive economic impact the supports of this bill espouse are an ill conceived pipe dream. there is no evidence to support the statement that there will influx of new recreational from north carolina just because these fish receive game fish status. there is a negative economic impactto those that make their living from our waters and that should weigh more heavily on your minds especially on these challenging times. i urge you to join me and stand up for our public resource, our coastal communities, consumers of north carolina seafood, and the hard working men and women along our coast and oppose house bill 983. [SPEAKER CHANGES] are we having fun yet. im willy Phillips, owner and operator of full circle crab company in Tyrrell county. we wholesale, retail, value add, cook and serve wild cuaght north carolina seafood. i fish pound nets and hoop nets during the winter in which we catch striped bass, speckled trout, and red drum. this time of year we fish peeler and crab pots (????) my first commercial trip was in 1970 i cannot speak to the biological discussion of this bill. it would seem logical to pay attention to the 25 million dollar agency that you fund, that provides you with the objective data needed to make the right decision. i can speak as a small business that employs 15 to 20 people and buys from a hundred fisherman a year. the impacts of house bill 983, should it be past, are devastating. Tyrrell county, where i live, is one of the poorest in the state. with an unemployment rate twice the state average. the economic multiplier that is so often used has an inversion factor as well that is a negative economic impact is multiplied many times in a community is already the most vulnerable. i write the checks every week. i know the consequences. passage of this bill kills commercial fishing in this state, kills the independent and entrepreneurial businesses which are the foundation of our coastal economy. and turns of proud industry into a sad legacy. this is no game. please defeat this bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] before mr Bruno speaks if you would please listen for your name to come line up on the side to speak, morton gascal, scott mcnaly, fred walker, rick scrogs, phillis styles, michael clark, hardy i apologize for your name, hardy if you're from oppercoke please come speak i can't read your last name, john hilslop, ernie forester, jeff oden, don oden, james rebeul, jimmie nobbles, and rainer james. if you would please line up here and i and the sergeant at arms will instruct you further, you may proceed, thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] my name is keith bruno, im a commercial fisherman in the morning i pack local seafood for other commercial fisherman in the afternoon, and a commercial fisherman again

??...the recreational sector says they're worth 93 million dollars. They're worth 93 million dollars 'cause they want to be worth 93 million dollars. I've got two small boys at home, they can catch a limit's stack of trout with a cane pole and a bucket of minnows. It didn't cost them 10 dollars to go fishing, and they catch the same amount of fish as somebody with a 60,000 dollar bait boat and 500 dollars worth of tackle bought that day. I packed seafood for local fellas, I've got one man, a commercial fisherman, is going to do enough to feed his family, support his people. This boy, he's had a tough time of it all winter. Hadn't caught a lot of oysters, didn't really get the gist of catching the speckled trout, but striped bass came around. He come to me, he sold almost 700 dollars worth of striped bass that week, he got his check on Friday, he went, he was so happy, his new young baby, went to the mama's house, the babysitter, and he took his girl to the restaurant. He took her to the same restaurant that I sold them striped bass to. Them striped bass, he give the restaurant the money that the restaurant bought them striped bass from me. That money made a complete little circle inside of two miles Pamlico County. That's real economics, and it's real important, and it involves real people. That Mirrolure that these recreational fisherman go and buy, it's manufactured in China. It's not manufactured in Pamlico County like that striped bass was. So that money is now going to China, we're going to have to spend more money getting seafood from China, all our dollars are going overseas, and what do we got? A bunch of recreational fisherman. This is about money? Let's keep the money here, let's keep it local, and support our people that live there every day, not somebody who might live from away and might come down and might spend money. They could do the same thing with a 10 dollar cane pole and a bucket of minnows. Thank ya'll. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Good afternoon. My name is Fred Walker. Thank you for having this forum. I'm here to respectably ask you that you support HB 983. It would bring good management practice back to a valuable fishery and at the same time, increase jobs and improve the economy of North Carolina. I'm a lifelong resident of Pender County and was an avid fisherman of many years. I raised my children around some areas ya'll will recognize - Topsoil, Elmores, and Ridges Inlet, fishing. Job requirements and some health issues took me away from fishing for years, but when my wife and I retired a few years ago, we started fishing again, and were appalled by how few fish they were. There weren't any red drumspecks, stripers, flounders, croakers, all the fish that we had caught down in the Wilmington area in the past, you just didn't catch many. You know, if you caught just a few, you were really happy. I started researching and found that we truly had over-fished our valuable resource through poor management of our commercial fishermen. I'm a retired magistrate and the first thing that I did when somebody came into my courtroom, I said "let's separate the facts from the emotions", and the facts are, if you look at it, and you look at the science, commercial fishermen themselves have shown that only a small portion of that income came from these types of fish. In 2012, per a North Carolina Division of Marine ?? only 77 fishermen made 10,000 dollars or more from these species. All the states that have made this decision have improved their economies, they have great seafood, look at Louisiana. Great fishing industry jobs, great seafood, and great tourism. I'd like to share a quick excerpt from the October, 2011 North Carolina Sportsman's article, a person who makes his living in Brunswick County, and I'm paraphrasing - I hate to say it this... I'm out of time. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] My name is Rick Scroggs, and I'm from Swansborro, North Carolina. I belong to a great conservation minded sports fishing group called the Cape Lookout Flyfishers, and on occasion we ask experts from all across the fishing spectrum to come and address the club. We've had Preston Pate, and director Daniels from the Division of Marine Fisheries, direct our group, but probably the one individual who had the most impact on me as a fisherman was a man named Charles Brown. Charles was a long time commercial fisherman, lived on Harper's Island, unfortunately see he succumbed to cancer, not to long ago. Charles...

told his personal story to our club where he switched from being a commercial fisherman to being a guide because he could finally make enough money to provide for his family. He took out hundreds of people in his business. And getting to know him just a little bit more than at our meeting and at a banquet, he cared a great deal for the resource. And he taught his people about conservation and about not filling up with cooler but just enjoying the resource as it was. I would like to think that this bill will help, in the spirit of Charles Brown, to keep the resource alive and well for all of us. And I think for him to have had that turning point in his long career on water to go from ?? was an instructional lesson for all of us. So I hope that you will support this bill. Thank you for the opportunity. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Hi. My name is Scott MacNally. I'm from Ocracoke. I have SMacnally's Raw Bar and Grill and Gaffer's Sports Pub also, both of which buy local fish, all three of what we're talking about here today. I think we should not deprive the tourists that come of the fish that we're speaking of. We saw a lot of red drum. That's what people want. And I think that I should be able to support local fishermen by buying their fish, supporting our local economy, our state economy, and not giving it to someone, whether it be out of a farm in Vietnam or whether it be out of a farm in Louisiana. So, I support our local fish. I buy North Carolina fish. I would like to continue to support our local fish. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] My name is John Hislop. I'm from Hubert, North Carolina or Bear Creek. I finished high school in Elizabeth City, North Carolina. I've worked around the water. I've been around the water. I brought my family back to North Carolina and wanted them to have the experiences that I had as I was growing up in those areas. I can remember in the fall of the year, when the yellow butterflies would fly, we would go get our spot net, and we'd put our spot net out, and we'd catch spot and either fifty pounds or a thousand pounds, depending on where we set it, and everybody had a large time. But, all of a sudden, over the years, the spot started to dwindle. We used to be able to go out on the beach and see them for miles. Now, you don't. Now, you come down here, and last year, Carteret County spent over a hundred thousand dollars advertising that there was a good spot run. It lasted for about two weeks. It filled up every motel, every restaurant in the whole area. This is the same thing that's gone on. Our fish in eastern North Carolina have gone downhill and need to be taken care of. I think this bill is a good way to start. I'm in favor of it. If you don't think so, look at your gray trout. Look at your croaker and these other species. They're virtually gone. We have to start managing our resource, and we have to start taking care of it. I know there's a lot of people in here that I've grown up with that have different feelings than I. And I'm surely not the rich white guy with the big boat. I just want my family, my children, and my grandchildren to enjoy North Carolina like I have. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Hi. My name's Jimmy Nobles from Greenville, North Carolina. I'm a commercial fisherman and owned West End Seafood of Greenville for the past thirty years. And I spent probably ten or twelve years on advisory committees for the marine fisheries. One of them was the Inland Advisory Committee, and it was dominated by CCA members. And I got to know them and became friends with them. The first thing I'd like to say is CCA doesn't represent all recreational fishermen. They're a group of themselves. And I had the honor to be on the first red drum advisory committee. And it was commercial fishermen against recreational fishermen. Well, we lost. It became a by catch fishery. Three fish. That's it. And now, I don't know why we're here. I mean fishery management is working. And now, all of a sudden, we want to just

...the rules because things didn't work out exactly the way one group wanted it to. Do your best, vote against it. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Before Ms. James speaks, I'd like to read out the next sheet of names. Please come up to the sidewall here and the Sergeant-at-Arms will instruct you. Glenn Skinner, Kelly Pitella, Mike Pitella, if I butcher your names, I apologize. Allison Willis, Lynn Peterson, Chelsey Brown, Tim from New Bern, I can not read your last name. Rick Braxton, Kim Travaso, Kenneth Singler, C.R. Frederick and Perry Wood Beasley, Sr. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Good afternoon. I'm Rangor James, I'm from New Bern. And about the representatives who are here. I really surprised that they've stirred up quite as much controversy as they obviously have. I'm sure that's not what was actually intended. I have been in business, I'm retired now, but I've been in business for a number of years. So I have a different perspective. I see this more from the perspective of a business person and a citizen, a taxpayer, that sort of thing. I feel like it is about jobs. It is about finances. It is about choosing winners and losers, but more than that, it is about limiting the freedom of choice and all kinds of freedoms of individual people. I see that as a very wrong thing to do. It's happened, this choosing winners and losers, has happened at different levels of government over a period of time, inch by inch by inch. We are killing the geese who are laying the golden eggs. Instead of protecting our people and their rights, we are squeezing them. Is that what we want to be doing? I think we need to rethink this. I think there's a better way and I'd appreciate it very much if you find it for us. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Good afternoon. My name is Jeff Oden and my family's roots on the coast go way back. I can say this, it's my great, great, great grandfather was shipwrecked on Hatteras Island in the mid 1800's and subsequently married a Native American. According to popular belief, some have said that Grandfather John Oden washed ashore in a pork barrel. The irony isn't lost to me that this bill, HB 963 is loaded with a lot of pork. At present, I run my family's ocean front motel, which was established in 1955. I also commercial fish and thank God for the opportunity that I, since I can certainly tell you that in Hatteras Village, at least, the economy hasn't been the same since Hurricane Isabell. Between the economy, lack of beach access, lack of rational solutions to our highway problems, and now of course, you can add this elitist agenda aiming to take one of the last reasons for people to come to the coast, which is fresh, local seafood. The question is how many nails does it take to nail the coffin shut? Over time it would be interesting to know how many males my family members have made. One of the three species that we're here today to talk about taking off not only my family's table, but yours, too, possibly, if you don't have the means to get to the coast and access it. How can anybody put a price tag on a resource access and a heritage such as that. I win this by looking back to my roots. Might be scratching at somebody's eyes, but prior to the European's arrival at these shores, the Native Americans essentially led nomadic lifestyles, even on Hatteras Island where they spent their summers on the shoreline and their winters in Buxton Woods, never claiming ownership to the lands, the winds, the seas, or the sky, since they all realized they were just passing through. That way of thinking certainly has more relevance in this bill. As concerning this bill, you morally don't have the right to give these resources away. They are the people's, be they red, black, white, consumers or yes, even recreational anglers. Finally, it is time to bury this hatchet once and for all and you're wasting valuable time that could be spent solving the State's far more pressing... [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] My name is Glenn Skinner. I'm a commercial fisherman out of Carteret County. I came here today to discuss the economic defense that supporters of this bill are...

...you think. I can tell you that these fish account for thirty to forty percent of my income some years. And in the wintertime, when I really need it, they're up to ninety percent of my income. As important as this is to me, the supporters of this bill say it's not important to our state. These same people are asking out state to spend $1 million of taxpayers' money to pay us not to catch these fish. Let me say this again -- they're asking you to pay is to quit providing revenue to our state. Now this does not sound like a sound economic plan to me. These same people would have you believe that if you pay us to quit providing revenue to our state, that droves of recreational fishermen are going to plop here and spend their money. Where are these fishermen who refuse to fish in North Carolina until we pass a game fish bill? I haven't seen any; we haven't heard from any today. If they do exist, and they do come here, the Division of Marine Fisheries has said that it will have a detrimental effect on our stock. That in turn would mean less fish, stricter regulation, and less fishing. In my opinion, that would be a loss of revenue, on top of the loss of revenue that they're already asking you to throw away. My question to you is, are you willing to take an economic plan provided by a bunch of greedy individuals, who want this all to their self, and risk all that we already have. We have a thriving commercial fishing industry; we have the second largest recreation industry in the East. Folks, are you willing to risk all of that on some long shot of an economic plan that holds no merit. I don't see how anybody can justify giving up what we already have when we don't know what this will provide, we have no idea where they got these numbers. We have no idea where these people are going to come from, and even if our stocks can handle it. The Chairman: Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGE] My name is Kelly Fadill [??], and I come here to fight for my livelihood. Approximately twenty percent of my income comes from red drum, striped bass, and trout. I'm a hard working, independent, self-employed individual who has never had to rely on government assistance to support myself or my family. Banning these species from commercial fishermen and only allowing sports fishermen to benefit from these fish is a clear message from our government that they simply do not care about our well being. With ongoing restrictive fishing regulations and high gas prices, it is difficult enough to maintain a stable income. Furthermore, there are many contradictions in this game fish bill that are being proposed. Only ten percent of the catch is actually commercially caught and sold. I estimate, in my local area, the ratio of commercial fishermen to sport fishermen is two to ten. So obviously, the focus wasn't solely on conservation. There's a high demand for fresh seafood, and if this resource is deliberately removed the harvest, it will negatively impact growth and tourism in our local communities. I am fortunate to have a commercial fishing trade and to be able to provide Eastern North Carolina with fresh local seafood. My integrity, focus, and dedication have made me a successful fisherman, as it did my father, grandfathers, and generations before me. This is an honorable profession and my only way to make a living, tracing back over three hundred years. Our family's heritage is built upon the history, camaraderie, and appreciation of the salt life. My family and I should not be financially compromised simply to support another luxurious coastal excursion vacation for sport. [SPEAKER CHANGE] My name is Mike Fadila [??]. The reason I'm hear to do is my daughter-in-law wavted to be here, but she couldn't, because she's a counselor at the Clay County public school, and she had to work, so I'm going to read a letter from her. 'My name is Jesse [??]. I am a wife, a daughter, and a sister of commercial fishermen. We're all scared that there is something to be lost. However, there is something that has already been lost. The human component of this equation has been overlooked. The fishermen, the wives, the sons, the daughters, and the grandchildren have all been forgotten. Our livelihoods, careers, and our occupations are all secondary if the effects of this law and the restrictions of this bill will be put upon us. I was sent to college, got a master's degree and allowed my future to be credited to the water...'

Can we shall have a much smaller firms to form before the advent of this life again and well-acted within those men on the subject of wish to report, which explore-line from losing them off when of this generation should be emotional award-winning three defenders above the center of the foliage or a small set in a smaller from this message of Christmas and other issues for the people who make up the small communities of state, country as we know what the judge for most mothers can say the first official from either North Carolina (SPEAKER CHANGES) , those 59 for a goldfish. Patient those fish is mandatory policy of allocating resources or single user could enter the exclusion of all others increase very narrowly defined target a single fish species which the result is always the same exploitation as five beyond their ability to reproduce and maintain the population than fish is a job killer eliminated this-this-fishery as we know access to resources always go fishing and the effects of game fish or social chaos economic depression and to lose for newcomers of earl fishing communities in every state in the developing the aegis of birch game fish limits or revenues fell play the same said jackets and five: to see a 1994 resulting in the bank fishermen and will, that might employ 21st education and the(SPEAKER CHANGES) recommended recognize all will benefit from access to health to Manna racial that CC eight times the cash that legislature reclaiming windfalls away the clout of our initial arraignment only a whole legislative needed it out as easy as clients and membership by legality state public rituals accounts , and many bay for all this, from where you guessed it did from the pockets of very public trust they came from sales as additional actions they differ on the opportunity to speak our generation and kokanee of original four H. Biondi three resources where you can look for pasta was sufficient experts were moved to the future of future economic prosperity for inshore saw were fishery unlike the commercial fishing industry recreational industry does not see or receive subsidy for tax breaks we pay our own way will always have and we always well and we're offering financial help from commercial circular couple provisions in the bill rate, specs a national strike the best or worst more to the state of North Carolina as a recreational fishermen and commercial fishery of actors no question about that issue as such we only manage more fish and wildlife populations state except Orange Shore store officials from the benefit of all our systems and they're not for sale that is the American model commercial fishermen will not become a business by the spill lives lost family destroyed the offer of proof of this early record did happen in the other stations; (SPEAKER CHANGES) some reason to believe that will happen here with a service station instituted similar legislation in the past 25 years not one has seen fit to return to their old ladies not one passage of this bill will result in increased populations of three fish when that happens fishermen will come to coach when they do they will spend a lot of money this bill fitch your pledge to increase jobs and improve the economy fits into a T the best of all people cost taxpayers one red cent -five and research to our state ??.....

My name is OK with Easley, while commercial chairs, long or go on from Virgo and loan there are two places nor any group of individuals or more self sufficient more independent more self rule out less dependent on government infrastructure north of commercial version sells with this issue should be in cars and worn by the government not eliminate more to get in recent history of serious problem has long opposed-birdie 19 as the IRS and the on-concert of negative consequences to the tournament official activity in the aftermath of the school day?? (SPEAKER CHANGES) the rest into the night is the only thing the dominant in the two of returnable was a commercial fishing bombers have a good offense a new commercial fishing get back to work within two or three days , economic engine version says complete, for weeks without the New York Governor Gilmore support the commercial fishermen said about the work is this a very unselfish to save our state, should encourage your shots dollar loan wash away the Sherwood such an industry where working were so well in the worst conditions which there were together was born with text this bill is wrong in today's economy bridge of the fetus ordination of women to work in jobs we have some of the telecom's and Tom and all we want to do was go to work industry so call for a country and would like to 40 support and fuel this deal, a recommended a major correction from Brian walker on Iraq a racial oppression and I'm an old traditions with an underscore the national resource I'm very strong players don't believe more than a decade later would like to see there's a bullet went into this sort of emigration four fishermen for 50 years(SPEAKER CHANGES) I was so his twenties and my reason for being a ball dollars call was from its religion by the day when fisheries is a limited strike in resource to discover that they only (fisheries website of savory quickly that number seven was numbered in the hundreds of millions are now they'll to the 30,000,000 Cambridge all this is not my data is the data that's a problem only fish and adoptions standing of its over 80% reduced water was in the 1981 to 78 through 182 oblique all we have to do something different of computing in the same thing over and over again (SPEAKER CHANGES) we should expect it, change is about they were the state's role for the British had its own recreational abuse, admissions fee is a public resource and you can use to pay a commission of that its operations with the Chavez’s to buy the place for the space can be used at all from the racetrack of the four songs for Nashville 93 budget , before next speaker if you listen to the end of the following names five was like seeing more and Steven Damon details and rob Ryan , cruise crucified his username is crazy some see that the regional as a movie like this the place to move here of elements and David Jarvis ray Collins, Kelly from SMS girl that that's OK lee Maxwell, and they played well, you're hoping to remove the pursuit that there remains are fervor for four or 57859 two and then a public trust 345333481 against a bad one, recruited from a restriction of Arcadia would have been saying they are bobby hall one of 205 that Jews on the Sea of Galilee dollars to five and one gesture and the students are much more there's not a part that the imaging commands 1009 will bear false witness to monitor the ??.....

What is being said here, it is an economic thing. The people that use these resources, either in the restaurant or commercial kitchen, are discriminated against due to the fact of their economic standing. Just because my boat’s not 60 thousand dollars, I’m looked upon while riding around in the water with gill nets on the back of my boat trying to make a mere living to stay off of any assistance program and to pay my own way, and that’s what every one of these commercial fishermen are here to do today. Thank you. Repeal the bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] good afternoon, everyone. My name is Chelsea Brown. I’m going to try to keep this as short and sweet as possible. I’m from Marshallberg in Down East Carteret County. I come from a long line of fishermen and I have a commercial fishing license. I have fished crab pots and nets with my daddy my whole life. Not much can compare to wild-caught North Carolina seafood – I think we can all agree on that. I was in fifth grade when I received my first string of crab pots, 40 to be exact. I learned a lot of very hard lessons those summers, but I have two that have had a huge significance on my life: I learned the value of a dollar, and I learned that commercial fishing is hard work, but it makes me so proud of our commercial fishermen in eastern North Carolina. I am here to present to you a petition sponsored by the NC seafood Coalition called ‘Keep Local Seafood on North Carolina Dinner Plates. Oppose NC House Bill 983.’ The NC Seafood Coalition, for those of you that don’t know, is an alliance of seafood harvesters, restaurant owners, local foods advocates and consumers united in the support of sustainable commercial fisheries and public access to North Carolina seafood. As of 5 pm yesterday, we had one 1,959 signatures from coastal North Carolina and beyond and from all walks of life. This was the online petition. We also had a hardcopy petition that had 13 hundred signatures. Those signatures have been included for your review. I encourage you to read the comments that were submitted as well. Not included are more recent signatures that total more than 2,102. Thank you for your time. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Hello, my name is Lin Peterson. I founded local seafood with Ryan Speckman in 2010. We’re based in Raleigh, North Carolina. We’re both fishers and wildlife graduates of NC State University. We understand natural resource management. This is an economic issue. Fishermen, whether recreational or commercial, constitute a very small percentage of the general public. Our customers come to us because we sell North Carolina seafood. We’re getting a resource caught on the coast or produced by NC agriculture to the consumers in Raleigh, North Carolina, and we’re doing it. Folks love it. They have it. There’s a demand for this product, and these three species are 20% of our total seafood purchases from October of 2012 until April 2013. We are buying these species, we’re selling them. There’s a demand for them. DMF is managing the resource. Our customers appreciate knowing where it comes from and supporting commercial North Carolina fishermen. There’s a great demand on local foods, as everybody knows. The trend, these restaurants on the coast all the way to the mountains have a demand from their customers to get a resource, know where it’s produced, know the guy who caught it. We’re telling that story. My great-grandfather Elma Wade was a boat-builder in Williston, North Carolina. He built recreational boats, he built commercial, very important commercial fishing vessels. We can all work together to manage this resource and get it to people. There’s a demand and folks really appreciate it, and they smile when they buy our fish and are happy for what everybody does in this room. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you for the opportunity to speak. My name is Jim Horton; I live in Greenville, North Carolina. I’ve lived in North Carolina my whole life basically. I’m an employee of Grady-White Boats in Greenville. I’m speaking on behalf of the company I work for. Back in 2008, 2009, the economy really hit our business hard industry-wide. Wholesale boat orders dropped in the neighborhood of 70 to 80% in all segments of market, so when you talk about taking a hit, I know what I’m talking about. I’m still feeling it every day. We have currently about 190 fulltime employees. Our jobs

...are mostly unskilled or very much semi-skilled, and the people I work with everyday are hard working people. They earn their living from recreational boaters and anglers. Our business depends on recreational anglers. The Recreational Boating and Fishing Foundation showed that about 33% of fishing participants own a boat, and about 52% of the participants considering the purchase of a boat were doing so for better or more access to fish. Anglers are interested in an abundance of fish, and the occasional opportunity for a trophy size fish. Recreational fishing does create jobs and does stimulate economic activity. It pays my bills, and it has done it for over 31 years. This is a tough situation, but the Bill will create jobs. I think the abundance of fish will help many people that don't directly touch the fish or commercially sell fish. We actually rely on recreational fishing to make a living. Please help us and support the Game Fish Bill. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Hello, I am Stephen Ammons. I am the executive director for CCA, and I am a paid staff, just like Mr. Sean McKeon is for the commercial industry. I come to you not as a commercial angler, and I had a script all written out, but I've sat here and listened to both sides argue for the Game Fish Bill, and I'm not a commercial angler, and I don't even ______ recreational fishing up because they work me too hard. I don't get to get on the war as much as I'd like to, but I do know something about heritage, county, farming tobacco all my life. I was picking up leaves at the age of four, so I understand a little bit about what you're saying on the heritage side. However, the state of North Carolina has to look beyond the heritage, just like it did in the tobacco situation, and do what's best for the entire citizenry for the state of North Carolina, and by doing that, they'll pass this bill, they'll pass the Game Fish Bill, and the money, and I'm not even going to do the figures, because the figures have been beaten to death by both sides. Thank you. But I also want you to remember another thing. The Bill not only concerns game fish, but if you look at the Bill clearly, it also allocates money for observer funds, for the flounder fishery, which is, from what commercial people tell me, is a whole lot more _____ than these three fish are. The Bill is providing money for observer funds, it is also providing funding for dredging, but it might not mean a lot to you smaller fisherman, but I guarantee you it means something to the bigger fisherman here in this room. They want that Dredging Bill passed, and that's part of that Bill as well. So it's not just only game fish. We're wrapped up in it, and I understand the emotion behind it, but please look at the Bill as a whole, complete Bill, and I think you'll be satisfied with it. Thank you very much. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Hello, my name is Dick Hamilton. I am a fish and wildlife biologist. I come to you today after a 37-year career with the Wildlife Resources Commission. Presently, I am working for the North Carolina Wildlife Federation, and we try and take an objective look at the management of all of the resources of the state of North Carolina and encourage the General Assembly to do the right thing. I am pleased to report that all the game fish and all the game animals in North Carolina are doing quite well. They are being managed quite efficiently and effectively by the Wildlife Resources Commission and the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, which manages the migratory game birds. No game animal or game fish has ever been classified as threatened or endangered. In fact, none have ever even been classified as depleted. Unfortunately, I can't say the same for our marine fisheries, which have been managed with a commercial component over the years. The _____ is depleted. Seasons are closed. The sturgeon is endangered. It is completely protected. The spectral seats are out, depleted, with restrictive limits. Gray trout, depleted, severely restricted. Yes, sir. Southern flounder, depleted. Menhaden, closed. Hickory shad, depleted. Another thing, I heard a lot about the 1997 Fisheries Reform Act today. I call your attention to the fact that the 1997 Fisheries Reform Act has a preamble which is identical to the preamble for House Bill 983. It says exactly the same thing, so it can not be referred to one way...

The New Salem. Six people divisional resources and tomatoes of the slaying tenders on the fishery reform act of love does not mandate a quieter efficiently manage people consideration of all commercial and recreational interests of spaces or best manages commercial phone post-quality and effectiveness into the managers of the fish is played without legal and industry tried this or move three IQ the main categories of humor and the economics of this deal takes about 20% buying come away with a split opinion poll are due to deal with the democrats recapture the commercial fishermen who supports both television rights measures view of HP 983 and has been established for many reasons turning to supply business to finish this edition is the stories of late Mr. Gifford of the gives the state minister for its source extreme, 83 will require commercial fishing into this part of the game fish to cast their lot as a result of the biggest part of the data from the share fee for the consumers, enjoyed before being allocated to the official sector, is that nobody would benefit from the dolphins and that this would be forced to waste the above us 4393 against either scored a game this solely by Battelle and September filling a fake money back… (SPEAKER CHANGES) Even as a minor edits a state of just five EST and coffee with the support of all other partners to discard when they lost because of migration money as jerry's question is the 93 tape is all about money they claim that we do the same thing is almost every other coastal state $1,000,000,000 in flood into North Carolina first portion would put their feet. As a traitor and is far from its doors away from fresh local seafood and regular recreational opportunities by a large force to keep more of the cats, to that of the regulatory involuntary discharge turnout would increase defense when the senate on a fishing off the many more people in closing I respectfully ask you to consider help-page B1 and three were destroyed many commercial fishing businesses serving as the years I think this really-speckled trout that are striped bass is banjo for the resulting regulatory discards we think about the families of suffered to also be destroyed from peers to be lost to consumers are gradually lose access to(SPEAKER CHANGES) Mr. North Carolina street. As one of them or Murdoch given free reflects a lack the afternoon, Mr. Hopkins (accounted for the current chairman of coastal Carolina taxpayers association Archibald like to welcome our representation for the people's house this afternoon of accurate from tacoma's listen to the surface and 4¢ a day and we are fully clear the two black book on the sidewalk like to read to you from section two or call one of the constitution street North Carolina sovereignty of the people of political power is 50 PM and arrive from the people of god would like originates from the people is founded on their way along with the news is that it's only for the good of the whole us to approach this legislation would go after showplace for challenge you to five in this prosecution would issue feels sorry to regulate commercial resource are people should you care to represent the Baca Marshall ensures larger editors of interest to people I believe that the natural resources or put your body story much greater than we ever got our phrasing beyond we will have to worry about the abundant a lack of those resources and a challenge to refer to the constitution before you take up any legislation that sure that the authorities to continue their NT , for next April embryo and explicit names, Hal James bill Manville of mud ??....

Terry. Terry II. If you signed up as Terry II, please come up here. Britain Shackleford and Burt Owens, please line up over here and the Sergeant-At-Arms will give you further instruction. Thank you. You may proceed. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] My name’s Alan Hudson. I’m a third generation commercial fisherman from Tampa, Florida. I spent 29 years fishing from ?? in Florida, and I also have 17 years experience in Venice, Louisiana where our coastal communities are all but gone. There’s not any amount of tourism that can replace the viability of commercial fishermen. When people come down to spend a few dollars and then leave again, that money’s not going to stay with us. Far as farm fish, you take in antibiotics every time you eat a farmed fish. When you take in antibiotics all the time, you cannot no longer fight off diseases that comes naturally to you because you’re all the time ingesting antibiotics. Farmed fish is not the answer. To feed a farm fish to make him grow 1 pound, it takes 12 pounds of wild-caught fish to make a farmed fish grow 1 pound. There’s more to it than just one side getting a few fish, then the other. We’re letting our fishers become corporate. The small boat industry will be gone, and there’s no getting it back. Once they take it, there’s no getting it back. They’ll never give it to us. People are saying all our catches are declining but they don’t ever look at water quality. You’ve got hundreds of farms dumping off in these sounds, and is anybody here to even care about the water quality? The pesticides, the fertilizer from your own yards. That’s all I got to say. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I’m Bob Rot from Onslow County. I was born here in Wake County and lived in Harnett County. Went in the US Army in 1955. Moved to Onslow County in the ‘80s, and soon after that it was involved with marine fisheries. When North Carolina created the four regional advisory committees, I was selected to be one of the… first two terms, one of the co-chairs. At the present time I serve on the North Carolina Sea Grant Committee… I’m sorry, Fishers’ Grant Committee, for five years with Sea Grant. At the current time I’m serving on the Shrimp Management Plan and North Carolina Advisory to Sea Grant. House Bill 983 for me is against all I’ve been taught in North Carolina, that the resource should be available to all, not just a select few. I do not fish for any one of the three species personally. I enjoy two of the species; striped bass are kind of scarce as far as I’m concerned in our neighborhood, New River. We do not need rules and regulations for our fisheries? Yes. Do we need rules? Yes. Marine fisheries at this time has a good set of rules and are working constantly to improve the value and quantity of our fisheries. I enjoy fishing. Shrimping is what I do mainly, but without… it’s just House Bill 983 is just not for North Carolina. It is not for the benefit of our marine fisheries overall. Marine fisheries has done an excellent job as far as I can see. Yes, they need to improve in some areas. Everybody needs to improve in some areas. I thank you and have a good day. [SPEAKER CHANGES] ?? James. I live in Craven County, about halfway down to Cherry Point and Havelock from ??, and I do fish, but I’m not here to tell a bunch of fishermen what kind of regulations they ought to have. I’m here as a spokesperson for the Coastal Carolina Taxpayers’ Association and I appreciate this opportunity to oppose House Bill 983. Coastal Carolina Taxpayers’ Association, CCTA, but be sure to put the T in because I think we’re on the opposite side of this

Discussion that’s going on. I’d like to call your attention to one statement, an emission statement and also to one of the first law that I remember about North Carolina here. It is called First in Freedom. I hope you remember that one. Our coastal Carolina tax payers’ association advocates minimum government and maximum freedom. I’ve heard a couple of fishermen that I’m sure now what they’re talking about. Talk about being overregulated in North Carolina. First few times I went puppy drum fishing, I was shocked when we caught one nice puppy drum after turning about a dozen of them loose, and I was told, okay that’s our limit we got to go back into shore. I agree with the person that said if you want to increase the fund that fishermen get out of going fishing in North Carolina, raise the limits and expand the sale of the range of fish that can be taken. We’re dedicated in our association to the preservation of free enterprise and I think that’s enough said. I believe this bill is totally against free enterprise system and I urge you to reject it. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Before the next speaker I’d like to read the next list of names. Clint Blange. Michael Peel. Tim Roller, Chuck Laivorage. Donald Willis, Browny Drones, Dan Otem. That is through the list if you have not heard your name, I either mispronounced it very badly or you did not hear it but if you would like to speak, please come up here to the side and line up and we’ll get you in as quick as possible. If you look at the time it is 3:37. We would like to have everything completed by 4 o’clock and with the speakers help we’d like to keep the schedule due to session and other meetings here at the assembly. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you, my name is Bill Mendlelak. I’m a recreational fishermen. I’ve been fishing the North Carolina coastal waters for over 35 years. I’m part of what the Division of Marine Fisheries says is a million recreational fishermen herein North Carolina. I’ve served on several committees, the Inland Committee, the Red Drum Advisory Committee and I’m currently serving on the Northern Advisory Committee. I’m also on the Federal Weak Fish Advisory Committee. And what I’ve learned over the past 10 years or so that I’ve been involved in fisheries management, is that there’s a difference in the way you manage fish for recreational fishermen and for commercial fishermen. Commercial fishermen want lots of fish, they want lots of poundage, generally smaller fish that are give you a maximum sustainable yield. Recreational fishermen on the other hand want an abundance of fish in the water. Lots of encounters a few for the table and a chance for trophy fish. And we have lots of examples where the division has been schizophrenic about how they have to manage these fish. We have limits that are different sizes, different bag limits and so forth for commercial and recreational fisherman. But the question is, why do we even look at these 3 species. And the fact is that they’re available to everybody. They’ve available to everybody depending on not on rich or poor They’re available to everybody because they can be caught from the beach, from small boats, wading, you don’t have to have a million dollar boat catch these, you can catch them off the beach or off the bank of a coastal river. And the fact is and a good example of that is the world record red drum was caught here in North Carolina. It was caught by a guy who paid a couple dollars to fish off Avon Pier. So I urge you to look at who’s after this, who does this benefit, and I urge you to support this bill. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] My name’s Terry Backus, I’m a commercial and recreational fisher but I make my living off of commercial fishermen. Seafood restaurants and retail seafood stores will suffer without commercial fishing. Locally caught Brunswick catch, Carteret catch, Outer Banks catch, and Ocracoke Fresh are all terms that represent a growing movement to eat locally produced food. Retail seafood sales will be seriously hurt if we eliminate North Carolina’s commercial fishing industry. If you believe in made in U.S.A. products, if you believe n supporting home town production and if you believe in the small time independent entrepreneur than you do not want imported seafood. The game fish bill’s.

The one his subsequent film and then step two would dramatically reduce the availability of local seafood products in seven days' notice of the officials is economically by will close its retail market sale over enter on limiting the sale was a disaster at plum borough is from voters Caroline recreational fishermen contractor also taxpayer support from the bill also pursue a plague of seconds sat here and people are a house bill 93 as a result of many years attempting to work with the process are sprouting fishery the format my seven CCA members and others at volunteer to work with this process for years and many years I spent six years on a committee this morning that MSAS five, but to learn about all the issue before them and some polling stakeholders that a good information given advice on porcelain too often the result is advice and has been ignored an example was three years ago and the MSN you meeting in New Bern speckled trout and then do is pass that people who plays a good step in the right direction reality struck when a few days later a nominee was column and the vote was telling resend it became obvious than the process was flawed and that Congress would not result from bassford today that, North Carolina still lighting was always a special edition North Carolina the document provided request of a legislator to South Carolina cash and read from after doing this on a car in the Amaral and sales good probability to follow their inshore waters and drop them into Canada salmon be lost in the head out Marsala course (SPEAKER CHANGES) but Sam back Sam Lohr newspaper North Korea Center they have no larger than the spotlight have if it's a people go there even more as a habit of Texas and Louisiana and they're catching they'll go fishing deluge job goes by so much in one case(SPEAKERC HANGES) but Collins is not a place to take the family of 5 to 3 year old, banks are suppose it's ever been much worse obligation by the name is cleared away June, native Korea North Carolina and commercial fishing is there a way of life from a family for liver censure embedding save the mother's house bill Monday for peace. Or a species of fish to provide for my family and feeding of our fill of pasta would have a tremendous effect on the local economy any people would visit our persona come to enjoy a refreshing Walpole look and see for anyone has ever had the pleasure of being the stairs is not want to see that replaced with former A's are imported fish only 3% of north Carolinians or recreational fishing with the special concern by so many others would no longer have access to use this window without 15,000,000 consoles we already strictly on the number of fish would think it's a method taken to protect the species from being overfished with this bill passes nine no longer able to catch them so these fish to be devastating to me and my family and many others on I just want to continue making an honest living it was passed down to the army years to come back as 181315 generation or more, right out of the store to believe that stable Carolina with that one group of freshmen extort course the first U.S. Wheat industry says the U.S. observers find the right way of honoring women's day: go-to said U.S. fish and one of fish will a recession a finite the recreational kids 70% of our more than 30% were worried most difficult of the Jordan see if they'll stop boil for more, we fished bring $55.00 bill for good when see 1825 ??.....

dollars a piece roughly, red drum and speckled trout, thats because of regulations, we are doing pretty good. Its sin for them to be floating around and discarded, we need to sell them. [SPEAKER CHANGES]I am Browny Douglas the current Republican Chairman of Dale county. Having in the past been a full time commercial fisherman, and being a 20 year veteran of controversy with the CCA. It could not be more clear to me that the CCA's agenda is, and always has been about control. 100% control of access to public resources for themselves only. Sound science has always failed them, but there muscle money has not. But with the current economic downturn and new leadership of and withing North Carolina's Legislature, they, the CCA, pounced with promising visions of economic grandeur. A vision of success that has yet to materializein any of the CCA's victim states, except for the 2011 attempt of HB353 North Carolina law makers have been void of Fish resistance since the passage of the Fishery format from 97, Therefore a great portion of North Carolina's present legislature is fundamentally uninformed on this topic of debate. Making them blindly vulnerable to the steal;th intentions of the game fisherman. These intentions being the satisfaction of fulfilling there own selfishness, all the while somewhat mirroring the practice of extreme environmentalism. On March 1st at a meeting in Wancheez Representative Tom Murray told fisherman they eneded to reinvent themselves. I respectfully contend that Representative Murray should make that suggestion to the coastal conservation association. North Carolina is now so to speak serving as a dam, a wall of protection for the states north of us. The state needs to reject the agenda of the CCA which will help defend the states to the north, And hopefully help those to the south regain natural, natures social, econimic, and scientific balance. Thank you for this oppurtunity [SPEAKER CHANGES]Good afternoon, i am Donald Woolice from Auburn North Carolina, Im a second generation of my family that has made there living from the recreational fishery. I ask for your support for HB983 because its a wiser use of our public trust resource. It will generate 6.5 times more jobs, 12.5 times more in sales. This is turn will create a larger tax base that will benefit all North Carolina residents. If the game fish part of this bill passes today, the net effect would be a 9/10's of 1% loss of the total commercial catch,leaving for them, and if consumers of sea food of the state of North Carolina, 99.1% of the prior catch. Thank you for your time and efforts in looking into this. [SPEAKER CHANGES]My name is Tom Roller, and i live in Carter County North Carolina, i would like to voice my support for all aspects of house bill 983. I have been a full time working waterman for 11years, I run a full time small business as an intro fishing guide, and i want to emphasize that i do not fish for fun, i fish for a living. Unlike the majority of commercial fisherman and charter boat captains here, red drum, speckled trout and striped bass comprise the vast majority of my landings. I bring clients from all of the state of North Carolina and all corners of the United States, 12 months of the year. This is vitaly important to the health of our coastal economy. recreational angling is not simply about catching a bag limit. its about perception, abundance, and the experience. Game fish management enhances these qualities that atract people to the coast. This is different from managing for maximum scanable harvest. Recreational fisherman value and pay to experience more fish left in the water. This is why most of our fellow southern states have granted gamefish status to those fish and never looked back. DMF data indicates that the popularity of intro fishing is growing, we have all the ingredients for exceptional fishing in this state. We need to encourage more jobs like

Mine which have less of a negative impact on the resource while creating vastly more income and better economic returns to the state. I encourage you to look at the DMF economic impact estimates. And make your decision on the best allocation of these valuable public resources based upon that analysis. I would also like to emphasize that this bill provides observing funds to keep flounder gillnets in the water. While this fishery cost nearly as much to observe as it generates in landings, this bill provides an acceptable compromise. It gives both user groups their most fundamental necessities. I trust DMF data and I trust their science, but as an agency they are not charged with creating economic value as demonstrated by the tax payer subsidized and unprofitable flounder gillnet fishery. I encourage you to make a decision that'll support a fishery and coastal economy that will sustain us long into the future, thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] My name is Charles ?? Jr. and I live in ?? North Carolina. I'm opposed to this house bill 983. In 2008 the same three fish had a bill come up about game fish. It didn't pass. I have a newsflash the recreational fishermen did not lose any income. They didn't commit suicide, they didn't sell their boats, or their fishing gear. They didn't stop fishing or coming to the coast. They didn't buy golf clubs, or tennis racquets and join a country club. And all the recreational support industry did not lose income. Life went on just as before. Spending money coming to the coast, going fishing, and having fun. So if this bill doesn't pass that law the recreational fisherman as before won't commit suicide, won’t stop fishing, will come into the coast. Life will go on just as before with no negative impact at all. It won't affect the income, or the income of the support industry or their way of life. What this bill would do if it is passed, it would hurt the fisherman and their way of life. It will also harm the sport of the support industry for commercial fishing. And hurt the consumer who enjoys eating wild caught fish including striped bass, speckled trout, and red drum. Thank you for the opportunity to speak. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I'm Mikey Daniels from Long teeth, North Carolina. And I wasn't gonna speak, but I feel like I have to. There's two story's here, two clear cut stories. We were getting on the bus we were leaving ?? this morning, 40 men gathered together and we all joined hands, and we prayed. He said God we can't fight these people by our self. Lord you know who we are, you know what's going on, we need your help. And that's what it is, I have trouble sleeping nights worrying about what's gonna happen. I wanna ?? fishers meeting. I hear a lot of things said up here. But a lot of things you'll hear it's not the truth, that's why we have to be real careful. Or one day we're gonna have to ?? of our self what we've done, and what we said, and where we are. The ?? fishing in North Carolina's in terrible condition, and we need help. And you'd think you're trying to get more jobs, we need to secure the jobs that we have right now. I would love to sit and I could talk to you for hours about what we need to do, what we need to do is we need to come up here to see you. We need to tell you what we need, where we need to go, what we need to do. We need to come up here and tell you what kind of fish we catch, with what kind of net. Y'all know nothing, about what we do. It is what is. What's the deal? And I say ?? my God why didn't somebody call me? Why didn't somebody ask me what we need to do? And how do we counter react this? Not one call. All we want is you, we want our voice to be heard. Our voice is not being heard up here. Would you please listen to us, we need help. We're worth something. My daughter last week she was a freshmen asked ?? she was a teacher of the year. We are good people, we're not bad people. Thank you so much, God bless you.

Sergeant at Arms if there are any more disruptions before our last speaker gets done please remove the people from the room. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Go ahead. [SPEAKER CHANGES] My name is Sonny Davis. I’m from Atlantic Beach, North Carolina. Me and my family has been in the fishing business for over 60 years. My daughter, my son, my grandchildren are running the business now along with me and we are both recreational and commercial fishermen. We’re trying to make a living out of the water. As far as a new regulation, that’s one thing that we do not need. We also we have the state, the Marine Fisheries regulations which controls the inlet waters and as most people look at it, it’s a book about this thick that you have to go through with to find out what you can catch, keep, the size and all that. And on the other hand we have another regulation that we have to participate in which is a Federal regulation that controls federal waters. That’s another book about this thick that we have to go through to find out what we can keep and what size we have and all this. I think the one thing that we do not need is another regulation stopping more fishing. We’ve had enough, and enough is enough. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for your attendance today. Your voice has been heard. Representatives, thank you. Senators thank you for being here. With no further speakers, please be safe on your way home. This meeting is adjourned, thank you.